LI BLog 4: How did conflict between the irish and the english lead to social conflict in/and a fight for civil rights in the united states?

BLog dialogue

Prior to the trip Level I participants will read the entire text, and read both websites. While doing so they should focus on the role of the Irish in shaping American History, with a specific focus on their fight for Civil Rights both in America and abroad.They will write, and post four response essays related to the chapters referenced within each blog (Blog 1, The Irish Story: Blog 2, Similarities & Differences, Blog 3, Friends & Enemies: ; Blog 4, Past & Present. Participant essays should reflect their beliefs insights, ideas, teaching strategies etc. related to the ideas presented by Egan's novel as well as the internet articles linked below In addition participants will respond to a minimum of five of their peer's posts within the blog.

Civil Rights Reading Assignments

LI BLog 4: How did conflict between the irish and the english lead to social conflict in/and a fight for civil rights in the united states?

1/30/2017

27 Comments

Blog 4: Past to Present

Please review the instructions on the right, when finished write a reflective essay related to the text that presents your ideas, insights, beliefs, and teaching strategies related to the text. The template on the right is provided to assist you in writing your essay; however, bloggers are not required to use the template.

27 Comments

Tasha Salisbury

4/11/2017 09:56:45 pm

The British Empire has been compared to a large, dysfunctional, blended family. Social media has taken this interpretation of the British Empire and turned it into something humorous, using comic strips and Facebook timelines to demonstrate ways in which Britain has tried to deal with its many “children” in various ways. The British parental figure will, in some of these comic strips, watch in fury as it’s rebellious teenage child, America, dumps tea into the harbor, or point angrily to America’s well-behaved younger brother, Canada and say, “Why can’t you be more like him?!” One “child” of the British Empire who is generally and noticeably absent from these humorous interpretations is Ireland. Perhaps because the history of the Irish/English relationship is fraught with horrific violence, or maybe because the artists who create the comic strips are Americans with a blind spot considering European history, these comics usually neglect to show Ireland in rebellion against its “mother” country. However, it would be Ireland’s rebellion and its tumultuous (at best) relationship with England that would lead to social conflict based on pseudo-scientific classifications of the Irish as a lesser race, and the religious persecution of Catholics by a mostly Protestant nation, that would create greater social friction in the United States. This social friction would contribute to the agitation for civil rights in the United States as the Irish brought with them their experience in civil rights movements and in organizing for civil rights. These skills, learned while fighting against English rule, would have an enormous effect on all American civil rights movements.
While civil rights movements in America often trace their roots back to the abolitionists, some Americans of Irish descent can trace their fight for civil rights to a time before they were born. After conquering Ireland, England would engage in multiple battles, both physical and psychological that would degrade the Irish in the eyes of the world. The clearest example of degradation and deprivation of rights by the English was the Great Famine. When Ireland’s potato crops were destroyed season after season by the blight, England placed its concerns about the free market above helping the people of Ireland get food. England could justify its refusal to truly aid Ireland by arguing for a free market. However, it was also aided, at this time, by a Malthusian belief that the world could not continue to support a growing population. In fact, it may have been, in part, the Irish that Dickens was referencing when Scrooge advised that the poor and hungry should die to relieve the world of its excess population. Whatever the case, England felt justified in neglecting the Irish and allowing them to starve. England could then point to the starving Irish as being worse than beasts because they would resort to any means in order to get food. The systematic starvation of one country by another burns hatred deep into the culture of the oppressed country. This hatred fueled a desire in Irish immigrants to prove that they were more than they had been made out to be. So, they fought. Their desire to prove themselves led to a social conflict in the United States as Irish immigrants felt that they had to prove that they belonged and that they were more than slaves.
Irish immigrants were aware of the fact that they had been in a position that made them comparable to slaves. Beaumont described the condition of the Irish by saying that, “I have seen the Indian in the forest, and the negro in his chains and thought that I saw the very extreme of human wretchedness, but did not then know the condition of unfortunate Ireland…An entire nation of paupers is what never was seen until it was shown in Ireland” (Egan, 13). Having been once degraded as being less than a slave, the Irish in America would not let that happen again. They avoided this situation to the best of their ability by trying to stay one step above slaves. They were aided in this by “politicians [who] urged poor whites to fight against equality; slavery would preserve their perch one rung from the bottom” (Egan, 178). This would lead to an impediment in the fight for civil rights in the US as Irish immigrants did not seek to stop slavery, but to avoid being the slaves themselves.
Avoidance of being made into something that was a lesser being by steering clear of the racial connotations associated with slavery was not the only lesson that Irish immigrants had learned in their years of fighting the English. Many of the Irish had learned that being “less” did not necessarily have to do with just a race, but a religion. Persecuted, in large part, because of their Catholic faith, Irish immigrants brought with them an understanding that civil rights did not just extend past racial ideologies, but also past

Tasha Salisbury

4/19/2017 09:21:07 pm

I'm not sure how I missed that 3/4 posts were only partially done. Can I blame end of the year teacher brain? Here's the rest:

Avoidance of being made into something that was a lesser being by steering clear of the racial connotations associated with slavery was not the only lesson that Irish immigrants had learned in their years of fighting the English. Many of the Irish had learned that being “less” did not necessarily have to do with just a race, but a religion. Persecuted, in large part, because of their Catholic faith, Irish immigrants brought with them an understanding that civil rights did not just extend past racial ideologies, but also past religious ones. Seeking religious freedom meant that Irish immigrants were likely to see “the Constitution was not only a governing document, but a blueprint for how people of dissimilar backgrounds could live under a single flag. Religion, ethnicity (to a degree), economic standing – these were secondary concerns in the masterpiece of the Constitution, Maegher believed. The Old World’s fatal flaw, enforced in Ireland for centuries by England, was the establishment of a governing religion” (Egan, 164). While the US had no state religion, the Irish Catholic immigrants were in another predominantly Protestant nation and were defensive of their beliefs. Their defense of their beliefs adjusted the understanding of civil rights in the United States as something that needed to be extended to religious, and not just ethnic or racial groups.
Irish immigrants did not just bring conflict with them to the United States, they also brought with them powerful experiences that would help shape the struggle for civil rights in America for generations to come. First, and foremost, the Irish brought with them a history of civil rights struggles beginning with non-violence before resorting to something more drastic. Even in the time of the Great Famine, “Maegher had not called for armed uprising, nor violence in blocking the food ships from leaving Irish ports” (Egan, 51). As would be seen in later civil rights movements, non-violent protests would be the first line of defense, with violence being a method of last resort, or something advocated by those outside of the mainstream movement. While this would not cause a civil rights movement in the United States, the Irish experience would sculpt America’s fight for civil rights.
Furthermore, the conflict between the Irish and the English would lead to the Irish understanding the power of collective bargaining. While unions in the United States pre-date the wave of Irish immigrants during the famine years, the arrival of those who knew how to organize unions and utilize their power would be something that the Irish learned in their conflict with the English and brought with them to their new country. In Alice Harris Kessler’s article, Beyond the Pale, she addresses the history of women involved in unions and cites Irish women as being among some of the best organizers because they were the most experienced organizers. The clash between unions and employers was a smaller scale of what many of the Irish had already seen, and their organization skills, learned while in conflict with the English, translated fluidly into their roles. This organization of union workers would lead to a fight for improved working conditions and other civil rights.
While not easily satirized by social media cartoonists and, therefore, overlooked, the conflict between the Irish and English should not be ignored. The way that the Irish approached the avoidance of being pushed onto the bottom rung of American society, and the integration of diverse religion into the fight for civil rights, altered American focus on civil rights. Irish immigrants helped to crystalize the focus on civil rights by using skills learned under the oppression of England to use tactics and organizational skills that would lead to the use of these organizations as models for later civil rights movements. So, perhaps the next time a social media addict looks for a rebellious “child” for “parent” England to yell at, it can be Ireland being yelled at for taking ideas about rebellion and equality and showing them to their younger sibling, America.

Cindy Ness

4/18/2017 10:16:41 am

Tasha will you please take the time to post the second half of your essay? Thanks so much.
Cindy

Gina Dansie

4/26/2017 09:09:58 pm

When reflecting about the conflict between the Irish and English for civil rights I kept thinking about how old habits die hard. The conflict began in Europe and traveled over 4,000 miles to a new continent. The Irish were at a disadvantage in that they were a secondary migrant group and were not able to colonize their own area independent of the English. They were at the mercy of the English in Ireland and continued to be at their mercy in America. The belief of the English to continually subdue, belittle and target the Irish did not disappear at their arrival on a new continent. In the “land of the free” it was easy to target groups that were different, especially when those beliefs were part of your past. The Irish were then forced to fight for equality on two fronts, both in their homeland and in their new.
As I think about how to add the fight for civil rights to my curriculum I know students will need a new way to think about this struggle and the different groups involved. So many students only think of the Civil Rights Movement of the 1960s, in fact, when doing a search for Civil Rights in America that is the only movement listed for several pages. I think that many of them would be surprised to think that this idea can be applied to various groups and that it is not strictly a white vs black issue. Many of my current students are vocal about being welcoming and accepting of all people, and will want to know why and how this occurred, especially among different groups of the same race. In order to teach about the Irish civil rights movement in America it will require both myself and students to delve deep into the history between the two groups and to really grasp the institutional biases of the time.
Another topic that could be used in my classroom using the examples of the Irish and English is the idea of a self-fulling prophecy vs stereotypes. Were the Irish unfairly stereotyped as a rowdy, uneducated, heavily drinking group, and thus made easy targets of people of higher social standings? Or, could it be that because the Irish were limited by both income and opportunity, as well as being “outsiders” due to previous history and their Catholic religion, they had low expectations placed upon them and they met them? This dialogue would allow students to make additional connections to the content and have a greater understanding of the dynamics between the Irish and English in America.

Ashlee Karpowitz

5/9/2017 09:12:52 pm

Your essay took me back to something Ryan said on the first blogpost: "The Irish story explains how location doesn’t necessarily change opportunity." This is so important to the whole story of the Irish and any immigrant. One of my favorite things to teach my students in the push and pull factors of migration. I have them list as many things in each category as they can and then we discuss them and find examples. The Irish had the push of persecution and starvation, and the pull of freedom. But like Ryan and you both said, even 4,000 miles away, they were faced with the same discrimination. They weren't able to leave it behind. I think that's crucial to the study of civil rights. Can you always escape injustices? I don't think so. It goes back to what you said about the institutional biases. Civil Rights issues are hard to teach kids today because I think they see equality so much differently than previous generations. They can't even fathom that there were colored and white drinking fountains, and that Lagoon was for whites only. Thanks for your essay. It brought 2 major issues to my attention that I'm excited to pass on to my students - migration and if poeple can really escape discrimination, as well as understanding old biases and how they shaped the fight for civil rights.

Christopher Jones

4/28/2017 04:25:53 pm

Whether it was active extermination, or ignorance of a problem, the Irish found themselves at the mercy of the English for decades. The Irish came to the United States, and recognized liberties that other Americans had taken for granted. Although they were still discriminated against, the Irish found they had access to the tools to help them fight for civil rights. This is compared to having no rights in England. When they landed in the United States, they found they could participate in politics to make change and protest in order to gain equality. When the Irish found they had this opportunity, they took advantage of the situation because according to their experience, there was no telling when these rights could have been take away.
The refusal of the Irish to become English would bring upon centuries of torture and domination by the English. Much of this was also because the Irish wanted to remain Irish Catholic, ignoring the King’s demands to adapt to new religious policy. King after king would fight against the Irish population, only to find that they were an “ungovernable” people.
Irish participation in English politics were limited. Thomas Meagher would work closely with Smith O’Brien through the 1840’s in order to gain stronger representation for Ireland in the English Parliament. Much of the work they did was frowned upon by the English monarchy, and often they found themselves speaking softly about their criticism directed towards the English Crown. O’Brien represented Ireland as an MP, but this was merely cosmetic, as he was often outvoted much of the time. Much of what O’Brien was able to conjure up would be dismantled. O’Brien was helpless when it came to arguing for Ireland, for it was only a century ago that the Irish were not allowed to participate at all.
While Meagher lived in Ireland, the English were always devising ways to take away power from the Irish. Meagher would finally find solace in the United States where he found a government which would provide a platform for his ideas. Meagher reflects upon his astonishment towards American politics. Meagher encountered groups of people who did not share his sentiments, but those were merely populations of people exercising their rights, not the government trying to silence him. He is constantly surprised at the position he finds himself in, saying that this would have never been allowed in Ireland. Meagher uses the tools of democracy to pull himself up to the rank of captain for the state militia on the outset of the Civil War; a position which would be near impossible to obtain in the old country. His position sparked controversy, as some authors wrote that, “Never again shall the name Thomas Francis Meagher be united with any of our Southern institutions.” As anyone knows, ‘there is no such thing as bad publicity’. For Meagher to be written about in such a way proved that his ideas, his speeches and his actions had been recognized throughout the years he had spent in the United States. Although his actions were being criticised, it still meant that there were groups of people who saw value in what he had been preaching.
The trials that Meagher and his peers endured in Ireland allowed him to appreciate the freedom which he would experience in the United States. Meagher’s recollection of his experiences proves that with all of the imperfections which exist in U.S. democracy, there are other situations which prove to be worse.

Tasha Salisbury

5/13/2017 01:23:51 pm

Christopher, I like that you put democracy in the context of a tool that could be used by Maegher in the United States in a way that it could not in England. I think this would be an interesting concept to discuss with students when talking about the formation of the Constitution and how the Electoral College works.

Jenni Klein

5/15/2017 01:25:55 pm

I really appreciated your post and learned from it. I can only imagine the hope the people from Ireland felt coming to America.They were oppressed, but unlike Ireland, had hope that they could rise from oppression. They could vote, have a voice in government, and express their concerns.

Melannie Pew

4/29/2017 01:11:16 pm

Ireland for centuries had been under the watchful eye and thumb of the British crown. From as early as the 12 century Ireland was under the political and economic control of Great Britain. The Irish were forced to leave behind their Irish heritage and adopted the British language, culture, and customs. Egan says “Nearly three dozen laws criminalized Irish dress, Irish hairstyle, Irish sport…Speaking Gaelic, or using Irish place names, could result in forfeiture and property to the king.” The British attempted to stamp out the Irish culture. Even King Henry, in the1600s, forced the Anglican church on the Irish. Then Cromwell came and led his New Model Army and left “a name for cruelty such as the passage of three hundred years has scarcely erased from memory”. Many Irish countrymen wanted to escaped this kind of life, and so found passage on boats to America where many served as indentured servants before they enjoyed their freedom.

In America, the discrimination against their religion persisted. They were bought and sold like slaves, and were treated with such brutality that many historians refer to the Irish as the forgotten white slaves. America, although independent from England, was still influenced heavily by British practices. Great Britain was the most powerful nation at the time, it was the most advanced and so set a precedence in many ways. Their disdain for the Irish spread to the Americas. Americans were Christian, both Anglican and Protestant. The Irish that came to find refuge from Great Britain found a slightly more forgiving society, but one with its own prejudices. The Irish had to struggle and fight to be recognized as equals with the native-born Americans that the Know-Nothing Party argued should be the only ones with citizenship. They argued that “[w]hat was happening to the United States was a conquest”. Egan continues by saying that although the country had separated from the English monarch and had thrown off “superficial trappings of class, rank and title, but it was still full of Anglophiles.” This is an apt explanation of society in the Americas. Not British, but still full of people influenced by British policy and rich with prejudice.

This prejudice led to a growing conflict between the Irish and the “native-borns”. Egan shows how this conflict comes to a head during and after the Civil War. The Union and the Confederates depended heavily on the Irish brigades, who fought with more aggressiveness than did any other unit. Yet, these faithful Irish soldiers were not rewarded, not giving leave, but asked again and again to give the ultimate sacrifice. Once the war ended, many Irish moved out West, away from the judgmental view of those “Anglophiles” where they could start over and make a life for themselves without attempting to fit the accepted status quo. It is clear how this conflict and struggle found its head in the way Great Britain had treated the Irish.

Gina Dansie

5/1/2017 08:54:24 am

The last part of your post mentions the Irish moving West to get away from the judgmental views and being able to make a life for themselves. I wonder if that willingness to move to the West overall helped the Irish to assimilate into American society and gain higher social standings. It seemed to me that part of the problem for the Irish is that so many were unable to leave the areas that they were in, leading to a continued cycle of poverty and discrimination. I wonder if having large amounts of Irish Americans leave those areas, combined with some (albeit, not enough) respect from the Irish Brigades helped them to assimilate more quickly and easier than before.

Melannie Pew

5/11/2017 03:52:28 pm

That is an interesting thought. It was undoubtably harder for the Irish to assimilate into American society when where they lived was to chalk full of other Irish. But like you suggest, moving out West, where out there all that seemed to matter was survival. This may have made that assimilation simpler.

Julie Smith link

4/29/2017 03:57:54 pm

The Irish and English civil rights struggle is centuries old and ultimately can be summed up in one word: Classism. People seem to have a need to feel that they are better than others, hence any noticeable differences between people are used to proclaim superiority of one group over another. Easy to see differences, such as race, are often used as justification for this behavior, but what about when there are two groups who largely look the same? What is chosen as the mark of inferiority then? The English and Irish Civil Rights struggle uses social class, or more appropriately a lack of class, to separate the people. Beginning with (or perhaps before?) traditional British feudalism, people were segregated into the powerful and the weak, based on what they owned or did not own. Having property set you above others and therefore marked you, in all ways, as superior. If one owned land, one had power. We see the continuation of this attitude with early American colonists, who coming from England, set goals to own land as quickly as possible, with the belief that this land ownership would literally buy them, or perhaps their children, credibility within society. If someone owned land, people listened to them better. Their opinions seemed to matter more. They had security, both physically and societally. These early colonists, many of whom were of the poor class in England with little, if any, chance of social mobility, were literally attempting to purchase social class by buying land in a place where social rank had not yet been fully decided because unowned land was still available. America did earn the moniker, “a land of opportunity,” for a reason, yet the Irish and English social conflict was, unwittingly but ultimately, carried over to America by those who were trying to flee it.
The very first line of The Immortal Irishman states, “For the better part of seven centuries, to be Irish in Ireland was to live in a land not your own” (3). Literally, Irish land was almost entirely owned by the British, thus leaving the Irish not only without a home that was truly their own, but powerless as well. This landlessness meant that you did not have equal footing within, or without, the law. You could not expect to be heard in court, except as a criminal or a snitch, you could not attend school (not even at home), and you were even forbidden from speaking your language outside of your own home (3). When the book begins, those downtrodden for centuries in Ireland were still being held down by an English boot that ensured that basic civil liberties were not extended to the people of Ireland, thus protecting and perpetuating the centuries old status quo. Thomas Meagher was born to a very small class of Irish people with wealth, his family’s fortune having been made early on in Newfoundland on the American continent, with the family and their wealth returning to Ireland before Meagher’s birth (13). Still, although Meagher himself was privileged, he recognized the disparity in his country early on and fought it through rebellion. With the potato famine raging, and droves dying daily, the Irish who could, immigrated to a land where a promise of a different future was still a hope.
Upon arrival in America, however, the Irish were still relegated to a place of inferiority, the knowledge and acceptance of their traditional treatment preceding them in a country largely populated by English immigrants, who even generations later, remembered the old ways. In addition, the Irish themselves held onto their “Irishness” despite the potential of injustices because of it, rather than trying to quickly assimilate. The Irish transplanted to America made their struggles against England a point of pride. Their hatred for their oppressor in the old country superseded their desire to become Americans, with people choosing to maintain their status of being Irish in America rather than trying to become like everyone else. This Irish nationalism in America is exhibited by the way the Irish turned out in masse to welcome Meagher and the other Irish rebels to New York City (137), the way Meagher recruited the Irish brigade during the Civil War, telling potential recruits that joining the union army was also fighting against the English who oppressed them in Ireland, and, as the Irish went into battle, flying the green flag of Ireland ( 240 ), as a separate and more unifying symbol of the brigade’s loyalty than the stars and stripes. After Fredericksburg and other battles, Meagher bemoaned the loss of the Irish boys, rather than seeing their deaths as casualties incurred by the Union army. The identity of these Irish immigrants was with Ireland and their countrymen, and their unifying force was their hatred of England, not their allegiance to their adopted country. Had the Irish in America truly wanted to assimilate there never would have been Irish welcomes for Irish heroes, Irish brigades

Julie Smith

4/29/2017 03:59:55 pm

here is the rest:
Irish brigades, or Irish flags. Because their ethnic makeup was the same as most of the dominant class in America, the Irish could have more easily assimilated and mixed more quickly, had they not chosen to hang on to their ties to their old country and old grudges against an ancient enemy. Assimilating earlier would have reduced the prejudice and denial of liberties in America, because in a shorter amount of time, had the Irish not been drawing attention to how they were different, no one would have noticed them since they would have become like everyone else.
Both of these situations, the need to have land to truly be able to move beyond the class level you were born into, and recent immigrants more strongly and visibly identifying with the country that was their former home than with America, are still seen in America today. Classism is prevalent and easy to see, if people only look. The following two video clips define classism, give examples of classism, and show that classism is common in America. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_5E7BsgF_o )and (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ClU9ESCT06M). In addition, when looking at the makeup of America’s poor, (https://www.census.gov/prod/2013pubs/acsbr11-17.pdf) of the white population in America, only around 13% are in poverty, the numbers for three other ethnic groups, American Indian or Alaskan native, Hispanic, and African American groups are, or are close to double that of the white measurement. Thus, more people of color live in poverty in America proportionally than do white Americans. With the exception of the American Indian or Alaskan native group, it can be surmised that the other groups were, at one time, immigrants to America. Thus, immigrants as a whole are still not doing as well economically in America as the white population. Also, according to the following article, (http://www.npc.umich.edu/publications/policy_briefs/brief15/ ) traditionally, lower income Americans didn’t often own their own homes. “Also, according to the same article, “In 2006, 38% of households in the bottom income quintile, and 57% of those in the second quintile owned their homes, as compared to 91% in the top quintile and 69% overall.” There was a rise in home ownership between 1994 and 2006 with the lower quintiles percentage of home ownership growing at a faster rate than that other groups, but this time period was followed by a worldwide recession which has been traced directly to lending practices to people who were not truly economically qualified for home ownership, who lost their homes. In other words, immigrants desire for land ownership and thus the social class rising that comes along with it, still has not been permanently realized for most. In addition, recent immigrants have also held onto their cultural identities from their home countries in similar ways to those used by the Irish upon their in mass arrivals in the 1840’s. For example, recent anti-immigration law has spawned a number of protests. At many of these protests, the Mexican flag, rather than the American flag, was flown. (https://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2016-06-03/mexican-flag-seen-at-trump-protests-has-long-history-in-us) What does this mean? Does it mean that Mexican-Americans have never fully assimilated due to prejudice in America? Might it also be that, like the Irish, they are holding onto symbols of their home country longer and thus taking longer to choose to fully assimilate? Or, because of their ethnicity and their inability to disguise it, will Mexican immigrants ever fully be willing, or be able, assimilate fully into America?
Ultimately, then, the Irish and English social conflict that is thousands of years old, was not only transferred to America, in part by Irish immigrants who were trying to flee it, but was also expanded in America to include other immigrant groups who, due to classism, have also been denied civil rights. This denial of civil rights has been shown to strongly correlate to immigrants who were also people of color, and groups that could assimilate racially, such as the Irish, have largely become part of the white majority despite early, and long continuing, exclusion.

Lori Robinson

4/29/2017 11:19:49 pm

Striving for a Better Future by Remembering the Past
A Psychology Today article, “Your View of the Future is Shaped by the Past,” makes the point that one’s “ . . ability to envision the future is strongly influenced by your [one’s] memory of the past . . . “ and that best way to plan for the future is to “ . . . set your predictions for the future in a familiar landscape” (Markman, Art. https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/ulterior-motives/201108/your-view-the-future-is-shaped-the-past). Although this article deals with research pertaining to individuals, it makes an interesting point that applies to history. When a group of people have a shared past or values that they share from the past, they can then envision and plan for challenges that might come up in the future. This is what is so important about understanding our history. An understanding of shared history can bring us together in ways that help us to predict problems we might encounter in the future and to plan for them (Markman).
While the Irish had centuries of experience with degradation and response through revolt, Black Americans were in an earlier stage in their own quest for Civil Rights. They had less experience at organizing collectively and at working within the political system for change. They did, however, have powerful leaders amongst themselves such as Frederick Douglass, Nat Turner, and Harriet Tubman as well as abolitionists like William Lloyd Garrison, Harriet Beecher Stowe and Horace Greeley. Many other Americans spoke out against slavery, including Abraham Lincoln who remarked that, “If the negro is a man, why then my ancient faith teaches me that all men are created equal, and that there can be no moral right in connection with one man making a slave of another” (Egan 161).
After the Civil War, Black Americans were briefly allowed to vote and participate in the government. This did not last long or come at a cheap price. The end of Reconstruction, the re-establishment of white power in the South, and the rise of the Ku Klux Klan would continue to relegate Black Americans to a subordinate societal class for another 150 years. They would experience Jim Crow laws, lynching, segregation, laws prohibiting marriage outside of their race, and a multitude of other atrocities. Their challenges would include a system that sold the labor of Black Americans who were arrested for minor offenses and then “hired out” by penal systems in the South—another form of slavery. Throughout these experiences, they would continue to strive for equality within an unfair system.
During the Civil Rights movement of the 1950s and 60s, Black Americans would begin to make true advancements and finally obtain a more equitable position in society. Black American leaders such as Martin Luther King would emphasize peaceful protest. Others organizations such as the Black Panthers would call for reform through more violent methods. Eventually, the Civil Rights Act would be passed, affording all minorities greater protection under the law.
The social call for equal rights and equal treatment under the law is one that continues to the present day. The contemporary social unrest within the United States has everything to do with what Black Americans have experienced in the past. Presently, the call continues for a change in the very fundamental institutions that our country was founded upon, as institutional racism is decried as an impediment to true social equality.
Black Americans have fought in wars in the defense of our country’s founding freedoms and understand that their people are strong and have overcome many hardships in the face of the challenges. To be sure, African Americans continue to face racial discrimination and the challenges related to crime and poverty. Their cries for justice and equality are ones we cannot ignore, must understand, and must help overcome within our society.
In fact, inspiring guiding principles, can take on a timeless quality and continue to inspire people later in history. For example, Meagher’s cry of “Ireland for the Irish” was used to rally the Irish in the Easter Rebellion. His speeches and sentiments were used to invoke courage and inspiration in those who would free their country from the 800-year British stranglehold. (Egan 318). Over 100 years later, President John F. Kennedy would visit Ireland and echoed Meagher’s feelings about separation of church and state— “I believe in an America where the separation of church and state is absolute, where no religious body seeks to impose its will directly or indirectly upon the general populance or the public acts of its officials” (Egan 318). That Meagher’s feelings that, “The Old World’s fatal flaw, enforced in Ireland for centuries by England, was the establishment of a governing religion” (E

Christopher Jones

5/9/2017 02:41:34 pm

Lori, I like the idea of "shared history". I am curious to see what this looks like in others' classrooms. I feel like I am comfortable when it comes to 'owning my whiteness', but it never goes beyond that. Meaning, I don't feel as though my understanding goes beyond feeling sympathy when it comes to discussing minority groups who struggled, or are still struggling, for equal rights in the United States. It is something I want to do better at as a teacher.

Lori Robinson

4/29/2017 11:20:29 pm

That Meagher’s feelings that, “The Old World’s fatal flaw, enforced in Ireland for centuries by England, was the establishment of a governing religion” (Egan 164) would be restated over 100 years later, is another indication that founding principles of our government and culture contain truths that withstand time
Such truths as this, when passed down in a culture, are what helps that culture to remain alive, intact, and hopeful of positive change in striving for an ideal. That Black Americans would cling to the ideal stated within the Declaration of Independence, “ . . . that all men are created equal,” and continue to strive for that ideal further illustrates the point that common principles are ones that have guided and can continue to guide our success as a nation.
As Kennedy spoke in Dublin, the country from which his grandfather emigrated, he “ . . . noted that Benjamin Franklin had sent leaflets to Irish freedom fighters, that Daniel O’Connell was inspired by George Washington and that the emancipator Abraham Lincoln was influenced by the rebel Robert Emmet (Egan 319).” Kennedy went on to ask what it was that got the Irish through so many years of persecution with very few periods of happiness. He then answered his own question “The ‘quality of the Irish,’ the president concluded, is ‘the remarkable combination of hope, confidence and imagination’” (Egan 319).
Egan concludes his book with the statement that memory of history is not an “ . . . unwelcome burden, but the raw material of stories that will always be passed on, in song, verse or tale, the great survival skill of the Irish” (Egan 319). This quote could be replaced with the moniker of any group struggling for civil rights and would be true if that group found meaning in their past in order to shape a better future. Meagher’s believed that, “The Constitution was not only a governing document, but a blue print for how people of dissimilar backgrounds could live under a single flag. Religion, ethnicity (to a degree), economic standing—these were secondary concerns in the masterpiece of the Constitution” (Egan 164). Perhaps such principles are a North Star, as Frederick Douglass’ abolitionist newspaper was named, for our country to continue to follow in order to remain whole and continue to provide hope to those who find themselves in situations that seem hopeless.

Julie Smith

5/15/2017 01:15:34 pm

I like a lot of what you are saying, but I wonder about the idea that the concept that "all men are created equal" being a common principle. I think that today we would see it as such, but at the time the constitution was written, I believe it was truly revolutionary and really not a common belief at all. Pre-Revolution the American colonies were not only just a physical colony of Britain's but largely a repository of British thinking too. Granted, the hierarchal thinking of Britain had been diluted over a hundred and fifty odd years of minimal rule, but I think there was enough influx of British thought through additional immigration and through the continual relationships made through industry, that "proper British social hierarchies" were at least somewhat kept up. I think this is more easily seen in the South, where the cotton trade likely made relationships with English businessmen very common as the cotton would have been used in clothing factories in England. As southerner entertained these important factory owner clients in their homes, they would likely have made sure to have followed proper English courtesies and traditions. In many ways the social system and rules of it of large planters in the South is remarkably similar to those followed by those of the inherited title system in England. Thus, I don't know that the concept of all people being considered equal (even if you only consider "people" to be people that look and think like you, i.e.not black Americans) would have been really believed. It was, to me, revolutionary for Jefferson to have included it.

Ryan Fisher

5/15/2017 04:15:18 pm

Your connection between Civil Rights and religion is interesting to me especially because I was watching an interview with a Civil Rights activist today. He was talking about his response to the death of Martin Luther King Jr., he was a close friend of King's who was asked to respond on his families behalf. He looked at the reason that such a large portion of Civil Rights leaders were preachers was because they had to comfort people in death, they had the ability to comfort people who were suffering during the movement.

Graham Stromberg

4/30/2017 04:19:22 pm

The following examples show how conflict between the Irish and the English eventually led to social conflict and a fight for civil rights in the United States. English oppression of the Irish coupled with a devastating famine led to the mass migration of millions of Irish to the United States. As a result of this mass migration, native-born Protestant Americans felt threatened by the arrival of people who were culturally very different and consequently discriminated against the new arrivals. In response to mistreatment, Irish Americans banded together as a major constituency of the Democratic party and used bloc-voting to advocate for civil rights. Ethnic tensions were further inflamed as the continuing influx of new immigrants drove down wages and led to increased competition in the job market for blue collar American workers.

Ethnic conflict between the Irish and other groups in the United States would never have occurred if there had not first been a mass movement of people from Ireland to the U.S. The first cause of the great Irish migration had to do with Irish men and women feeling compelled to leave for the new world because of the slave-like nature of living under the control of the English. Egan notes the lack of social mobility in Ireland when he describes how the Irish were affected by the discriminatory Penal Laws that were enacted at the end of the 17th Century: “it was the Penal laws that ensured that a Catholic would never sit on a grand jury, never vote, never raise a voice of protest or be granted the rights of citizenship... In Ireland, people were to be forever illiterate, forever poor, forever powerless.” (11)

Regarding the state of the poverty of the Irish people a foreign observer noted the following in 1837: “I have seen the Indian in the forest, and the negro in his chains and thought that I saw the very extreme of human wretchedness, but did not then know the condition of unfortunate Ireland.” (Egan, 13) The horrible conditions of poverty were enough to motivate many Irish to migrate to greener pastures, but the second major cause of immigration to the United States was the unprecedented potato famine of the 1840s.

As a fourth of the population relied solely upon subsistence farming of potatoes for survival, the near-complete decimation of the potato crop by an imported fungus would lead to more than a million deaths by the end of the 1850s (Egan, 39). A further stain on the integrity of the English comes from the fact that much of Ireland’s hunger could have been assuaged with the massive supply of wheat that was grown on the island each summer. With the hands-off attitude of politicians at the time, the potentially life-saving grains grown on the island were shipped away for the purpose of making a profit. It was during these most desperate years of the Great Hunger that more than 800,000 Irish immigrated to New York City from 1847-1851.

Prior to surges in immigration in 1830s, New York City and most of the United States was still dominated by a largely Protestant population. With the arrival of millions of Irish and German Catholics, old religious tensions reappeared, and with the native protestants holding most of the country’s levers of power, discriminatory laws were allowed to be passed. Prejudice against Catholics would carry over into the 20th Century as evidenced by the religious questions asked of John F. Kennedy when he first ran for office. It is interesting that despite Catholicism becoming the nation’s largest religious denomination it would not be until the 1960s that the first Catholic president would be elected.

With discrimination at an all time high in the 19th Century (think of the emergence of the Know-Nothing party), Irish immigrants banded together and formed a reliably Democratic voting bloc. In New York City particularly, it was the Democratic political machine that would take care of new immigrants so long as they voted for the right political candidates. As the Irish population grew, their influence on politics as a voting bloc would become large enough to sway elections. Presidential candidates could no longer neglect to address the concerns of a large Catholic population contingent. It was only with the assimilation of Irish immigrants into the mainstream, and the reduction of immigration from Ireland, that would lead them to start behaving more similarly to their Protestant counterparts (historically, Democrats were the party of the poor, while the Republican party was the party of the business and wealthier classes). As group differences decreased, conflicts between Irish Americans and other Americans also decreased.

Eden Ellingson

4/30/2017 06:12:07 pm

Not all Irish in Egan’s book were able to see the conflict between the Irish and the English paralleled in the fight for civil rights for all people in the United States. In fact, many saw a success and/or freedom for the salves in the United States as a direct challenge to their own ability to succeed in their new country. It was a process even for Meagher. It is clear in Egan’s book that at first Meagher saw the war as a way to train the Irish immigrants as soldiers that could later become a great immigrant army that would invade and liberate Ireland.

It wasn’t until the war was well under way that, and the “Emancipation Proclamation” had been given that Meagher realized he had to choose between fights. “For Meagher, England’s neutrality after the proclamation undercut one of his best arguments to the immigrant soldiers. They could no longer hold to the illusion that they were fighting two enemies.” (Egan, p. 232) Meagher knew that he couldn’t use that “hatred,” anymore—it just wasn’t enough. He had to embrace emancipation, and he did. Meagher, “defended (black comrades) as he had defended starving Irish peasants. . .’Black heroes of the Union Army have not only entitled themselves to liberty, but to citizenship.’” (Egan, p. 262) Egan’s book makes it clear that he was ahead of his time for the United States, but he was exceptionally ahead of his time for many of his Irish compatriots.

He was able to transfer his own suffering to the suffering of another people. For me, that is one of my goals as a teacher. How can I build empathy in my students? He is an example of someone who suffered for ideals, and died for them in the end. He would be an excellent character study for students of civil rights—he fought for them wherever he was. How can students fight for civil rights wherever they are? That is a question I would like to consider in class with my students.

Julie Smith

5/15/2017 01:21:15 pm

I like the question you pose about building empathy in our students. It really is impossible to build empathy without them having a concrete and complete understanding of the situations within history and how history repeats the same things in new ways. I think that when students can see oppression, not just of black Americans, but can see and recognize that other groups, such as immigrants, or women, were oppressed too - just in sometimes different ways - they have a greater capacity to recognize the same signals of injustice now. It is not empathy so much that needs to be created within the students, but a recognition of the types of situations and conflicts that led to oppression in some way. We really have to be able to point out the indicators and then help the students see the connections between the events so they they can connect their own dots when they read current news.

Ryan Fisher

5/15/2017 04:09:55 pm

I found it interesting as well that the connection that was supposed to be important between the Irish fight for freedom and the Civil War was not immediately found. I guess it depends on the perspective of the person, or the position in life at the time. People look at the issue at hand in perspective to their life, so maybe the individuals were consumed at that point of life with mere survival without having to focus on a bigger issue of civil rights.

Ryan Fisher

4/30/2017 08:26:35 pm

It is interesting to try and understand how the fundamental hate between the English and the Irish know no borders. When the English began their occupation of Ireland they did so with a ruthless endeavor that was aimed at complete political, physical, and psychological control of the Irish. They destroyed any hope the Irish had of independence time and time again.
This type of systematic control led to a deeply ingrained hate for each other. One that would not be subdued by the process of leaving Ireland and coming to the United States. People took this deep and bitter hatred for the English across the ocean and tried to find new forums in the United States to express and pursue their malice for the English. The newly discovered freedom of the press was one of the greatest tools that the bitter Irishman could use in the new world. He was free of any threat of punishment from the crown for what he wrote or what he said. He was able to rally his fellow Irish around his thoughts and around his drive for revenge.
These new freedoms and old grudges led to an interesting world in the United States for the Irish. The Irish were drawn into a battle for freedom in the U.S., but not their freedom. They became a pivotal tool for the fight for civil rights and the fight for freedom for the African American during the Civil War. For many the fight was the same fight that they had been fighting for as long as they could remember. They fought to prove that they were able to organize in a manner that showed that they weren’t just heavy drinkers, but that they were true warriors. They fought this fight against the South because to many the South was a representation of the English. They were a population that had dominated and subjugated another, They repressed freedom of thought, freedom of speech, and freedom of movement, similar to what had taken place in Ireland.
They also fought the war as a practice run to their own independence. After they had freed the slaves in the south, they would then go on to free Ireland.

Jenni Klein

4/30/2017 08:45:59 pm

The Irish people were conquered and controlled by an all powerful England. They were stripped of their culture, homeland, music, and more. These people felt no hope. When they were starving they received no help. So it was with no surprise that the idea of a true democracy sounded so hopeful and wonderful to the Irish. These people came to America and suddenly could voice their concerns. They were oppressed, but unlike Ireland, had hope that they could rise from oppression. They could vote, have a voice in government, and express their concerns. This was such an exciting concept for the Irish. Meagher speaks of the joy he felt when he was able to earn over a thousand dollars, simply for speaking! He was able to work with Lincoln, be promoted in the army, and sway important leaders to hear his demands. What an exciting concept for the Irish! And, once they could see this was possible of course they would fight to make it happen. They would hold their green banner high and fight the good fight to make their dreams a reality.

Jonathan B Wrigley

5/1/2017 03:26:09 pm

The history of the Irish is a long and sad history filled with a desire for freedom from subjection. In the Immortal Irishman we learned that the British had ruthlessly conquered the country and maintained control though tyrannical means.
For centuries the Irish had fought for independence from the British but to no avail. They were oppressed by Cromwell and treated like animals. But the Irish remained immovable in their desire for independence. The more the British tried to stamp out Irish heritage and culture the more they made it part of who the Irish really were. The British tried to stamp out Gaelic, Irish folk music, they denied the Irish rights to their ancestral land, and denied them certain rights because of their Catholic religion. All this only caused the Irish to ingrain these things deeper into their cultural identity and continue them in secret as another form of rebellion against British rule.
In some areas, over time, the British started to relax some of their policies regarding Ireland and the Irish were allowed to send members to Parliament. One of these members of Parliament was Daniel O’Connell who also became a member of Young Ireland, a political and social movement. He along with Thomas Meagher and other members of the Young Ireland group were arrested for treason while starting an uprising and exiled.
The lack of respect for Irish life during the Great Famine is just another example in a long line of Britain’s lack care and decency towards the Irish. Tens of thousands starved and millions more fled to other countries. After spending centuries under British rule, many Irish found an escape from tyranny in the United States.
Thinking that America was a land of opportunity and freedom many Irish were surprised by the reality of America. They faced racism, were given the worst types of jobs, given the poorest shelters, and had government legislation passed that was directed at limiting their ability to become citizens with rights.
The Irish did not leave the land of their forefathers and the yoke of British tyranny for another yoke under a different flag. Many Americans had British heritage and many of their prejudices against the Irish were derived from that heritage.
But America is different than Britain. You can march, protest, appeal to the courts, and do many more things to make your grievances knows. The Irish were tired of being treated as the dregs of society and fought to change that. Many of them became members of standing in New York and Boston society. They banded together to influence voting and the passing of laws.
They had a great deal of experience fighting injustice under British rule and they used that experience to fight it in America as well. After seven centuries of fighting the British the Irish were not about to back down from a fight and showed their grit by persevering in the United States.

Ashlee Karpowitz

5/1/2017 08:58:08 pm

In the beginning of The Immortal Irishman, Egan explains the long history of hardships and oppression faced by the Irish due to English rule and asks “What had the Irish done to deserve these cruelties? They had refused to become English.” (Egan, 4) This is powerful statement that really propelled my thinking throughout the book. How often in history has a group refused to abandon their culture and their language to submit to a more powerful authority?

Today I was teaching my students about the Navajo Code Talkers and we discussed that before the war Native Americans (especially their unique culture) had been looked down upon. Navajo children were sent to boarding schools, where they were punished if they spoke their native language and encouraged to erase their culture. Later we see the irony of that “cultural cleansing” when the Navajo language completely changed World War II, especially Iwo Jima.

The Irish endured the same oppression when the English attempted to “deny a people of basic human dignity. The campaign to strip the Irish of their religion had the opposite effect, making them more loyal to their faith.” (Egan, 12) I love this statement. What stands out about the Irish is that they were willing to fight back, they refused to be suppressed. In fact, that opposition helped them have a stronger resolve. Another powerful quote from Egan, “Religion was a way for a conquered nation to remain defiantly Irish” explains why the Irish continued to fight. Although their nation had been conquered and their food and fields taken, their spirit could not be crushed. I think we see that same spirit from the Irish immigrants who came to America. The story that stands out to me is when the Irish fight for their rights (by rioting) when they find out that wealthy Americans can pay $300 to not be drafted. The government had to know the immigrants would never be able to afford that, therefore there was no way for them to avoid the draft. Even though rioting is probably the least helpful way to fight for civil rights, it showed their resolve to make sure they had equal rights. They brought this fighting spirit along with them, and continued to fight for the rights that they were promised.

Eden Ellingson

5/14/2017 07:07:33 pm

I really appreciated your essay and found the Navajo Code Talkers example fascinating. It is astounding that the very thing that the United States tried to take from the Navajo--language and culture is what was needed during the war. I want to bring that into my classroom.

It is a surprising thing that oppression can often lead to a determination of the oppressed to keep culture, religion and traditions alive. I thought that was a great quote you used about religion "remain defiantly Irish." They did bring that fight to the U.S., and that enriched us all.

d2tEACH wRITING gUIDELINES

1. Write with your readers in mind: Who are they? What do they need to know? What should they know? How will they use your information? ALWAYS be respectful of differences of opinion.
2. Ask questions about the author's suppositions in the text. Be open-ended and open-minded when addressing the topic.
3. Provide links, and/or quotes when relevant/necessary to help readers learn more about your opinion
4. Each participant is required to post a minimum of four insightful posts, i.e. essays related to the text (at least one per blog) prior to May 1st.
5. Participants are required to read and respond to a minimum of five of their peers posts, by May 15th, as such it is imperative that all participants meet their deadlines. Plan ahead to give yourself time to brainstorm, read, write, and edit.
5. Pay attention to copyright. Use other people’s work with respect and link to your sources.
6. Stick to the topic. Don’t write about your weekend plans or gossip.
7. Think before you post. Ask yourself, is this something I want my parents, students , friends, strangers to see? What are the consequences if you post this?
8. Only post information you can verify as accurate. Provide links to your sources.

BLog dialogue